Swedish line infantry 1910-13

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Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  buistR on Tue 22 Jun 2010, 5:04 am


We don't seem to have any Swedish topics so far. So attached is a picture of one of those moments which makes being a conscript in any peacetime army so much fun - turning out the guard for no very obvious reason except to disturb their rest. The soldiers shown are Swedish line infantry. Most are in the (accurately portrayed) dark blue and yellow uniforms introduced in 1886 and worn with only minor differences for parade and service thereafter. The bugler however (plus a sergeant at right who Photobucket trimmed out of the picture) is in the M1910 uniform introduced that year. The grey uniform (universal for all arms) seems practical enough though the blue facings seem a bit profuse. The curious feature however is the so-called "Charles XII hat" which is quite simply an 18th century tricorn of the sort that Marlborough's redcoats would have worn. This throwback survived for several years until the lessons of the Western Front seeped through to the War Ministry in Stockholm. In 1923 an "earth brown" uniform was adopted with minimal decoration and no tricorn. In common with most peacetime armies economy was all important however and for a while photographs show grey, brown and even the old blue and yellow continuing to be worn side by side.

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swedish rank chart 1960s 70s

Post  wfrad on Sun 11 Jul 2010, 7:02 pm

Here's a rank chart taken from info from the Danish armed forces site and the encyclopedia site.
Colours are far from perfect but it gives a fair idea of the rank stucture.
Page size is a bit of a problem also, direct link is no better, sorry!

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc309/wfrad/Rank%20Charts/SwedishRanksMod.png

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WF

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ranks 30s 40s

Post  wfrad on Tue 13 Jul 2010, 11:55 pm

There doesnít seem to be an overriding authority on the exact translation of the Ranks used by the Swedish military, then again is there any exact translation for any country.
That aside, some of the NCO ranks have moved up and down the hierarchy over the years so I hope that I have managed to get it just about right for the 30ís and 40ís..
Thereís a number of term used for Warrant officer and senior NCO ranks so I have just used general grades like Colour Sergeant.
It appears that the regimental number or regimental device was positioned below rank badges for officers and also on the collar, other ranks/ NCOís had unit number on the shoulder and device on the collar
Generals had yellow edging with leaves, field offices yellow edging with badge and crown, junior officers yellow edging with badge minus crown. NCo's and privates badge without edging.
With limited reference I hope its correct!!!


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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  ChrisF202 on Wed 14 Jul 2010, 2:48 am

Good job Bill! You do seem to have gotten the post 2009 ranks wrong though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_ranks_of_the_Swedish_Armed_Forces
^ I know it's Wikipedia but it's apparently accurate according to the Swedish members on the uniforminsignia forum.

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rank badges

Post  wfrad on Wed 14 Jul 2010, 9:24 pm

Hi Chris,
I read that the Swedish Army were reforming their rank system, the WIKIPEDIA site just shows the old system in a modern style, not really a reformed system and may have not yet being updated.
So I rightly or wrongly assumed that they had just redone the old 2009 system for the new green style.
The site that I used to cross reference [ http://www.armyrecognition.com/sweden_swedish_army_military_field_uniforms_ranks/sweden_swedish_army_ranks_land_ground_forces_combat_field_uniforms_military_equipment_grades_uniform.html ] showed the rank system reverting to the older system by removing the four grades of private and such.
Since the 2009 rank badges have been in use for some time I thought it unlikely for the armyrecogintion site would make such a mistake but rather have done what WIKIPEDIA did and copy the 2009 ranks in green.
Until the official Swedish Army page updates it rank insignia Iíll leave is for now simply because of lack of official information.
This does not mean that itís correct Chris, just confused, with a healthy mistrust of WIKIPEDIA until I have at least another two independent sources.
Maybe if I label it Swedish possible future ranks?
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WF

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  ChrisF202 on Thu 15 Jul 2010, 1:42 am

Let me check the Swedish MOD, I am pretty certain I have seen rank insignia details ... it might have been the old version though like you said. There was also a lengthy thread on the uniforminsignia forum as well.

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Swedish m39 uniform

Post  wfrad on Sun 18 Jul 2010, 8:01 pm

This was taken from an old B/W illustration, Iím afraid that Iím unable to remember from where due to decreasing grey cells and recurring senior moments, previous blunder an example.
At the time the army were wearing brown uniforms with ankle gaiters similar to the British armyís.
The infantry badge for the period was crossed rifles, cavalry crossed swords, artillery flaming grenade and signals had a sword, point up with lightning bolt around blade. Armour appear to have an armoured vehicle with three lightning rods/bolts protruding from left and right of the vehicles turret.



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WF

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  buistR on Mon 19 Jul 2010, 8:18 am




Hi WF - well no-one can complain now that Swedish uniforms are a neglected subject on this website!

Just to briefly rewind, attached is a colour plate showing the M1906 (actually not introduced until 1910) grey uniforms and their tricorn hats. Also a close-up of the M1906 cuff insignia worn by all ranks - with true Scandinavian egalitarianism even privates (soldaten) had a set of chevrons.

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  ChrisF202 on Mon 19 Jul 2010, 12:57 pm

Wow, excellent find buistR! sunny

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Greatcoat m39

Post  wfrad on Mon 19 Jul 2010, 10:08 pm

Taken from the same b/w illustration as the jacket, like most greatcoats it could be worn with the lapels folded back, buttons for the jacket and greatcoat is a little vague as a few illustrations [not good quality ones at that] appear to show gilt and brown worn but Iím not sure if this is down to regimental preference, cut backs during WWII or just plain mistakes.
Style though I believe to be correct.

I have the illustration of the 1906/10 ranks and have been trying to find some additional material to cross ref with it, main reason is wanting to confirm whatís on either side of the generals curl, I would guess at stars but they could also be crowns, though unlikely.
Hereís another that you may like!

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WF

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  Animal on Tue 20 Jul 2010, 1:23 am

buistR wrote:


Hi WF - well no-one can complain now that Swedish uniforms are a neglected subject on this website!

Just to briefly rewind, attached is a colour plate showing the M1906 (actually not introduced until 1910) grey uniforms and their tricorn hats. Also a close-up of the M1906 cuff insignia worn by all ranks - with true Scandinavian egalitarianism even privates (soldaten) had a set of chevrons.

It's a damn safe bet that many of the men who wore those uniforms no doubt felt suitably embarrassed by the hat that came with it. While the tricorne may have been in style for Marlborough's, Frederick the Great's, Washington's, or even Napoleon's troops, it certainly looked a bit ridiculous on a 20th Century uniform.

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  buistR on Tue 20 Jul 2010, 5:42 am



Perhaps this photo supports Animal's comment - the three conscripts of the Sodermans Infantry Regiment look much more at ease in their old kepis and blue uniforms than their friend in his newly issued tricorn and grey.

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Scans of Sevenska Armens

Post  wfrad on Wed 21 Jul 2010, 9:32 pm

Mr Andreas Ohlsson of the Army Museum sent me these scans in .pdf form. I was going to do a rank chart but decided against it, I believe I wouldnít be able to do them justice which are far more readable that some pages we see on the internet.








Iím extremely grateful to Mr Ohlsson for taking the time and effort to send me these pages.
Regards
WF

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more pictures

Post  wfrad on Wed 21 Jul 2010, 10:54 pm

Hereís a couple of pictures that say it all about the uniform.
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=sv&u=http://www.tjelvar.se/varia/uni/11.htm&ei=zWVHTKuBM8uNjAfBhfT0Bg&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CEcQ7gEwCTgK&prev=/search%3Fq%3Daxelklaffar%2B1906%26start%3D10%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN
First guyís probably thinking after thirty years service he can at least hide his embarrassment.
Second guy, Iím off the second you turn around and the last guy just refuses to mess up his hair.
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WF

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Re: Swedish line infantry 1910-13

Post  buistR on Thu 22 Jul 2010, 12:30 am

Wow - that just about covers everything that can be said about the M1910 uniform. Thanks for posting all this WF!


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